The results of the concours for administrators are now out, and – surprise, surprise – I did not manage to pass. Here’s the extract of the letter:
The selection board for the above competition has now finished marking the pre-selection tests in which you participated. I regret to inform you that although the marks you obtained in these tests were above or equal to the pass mark, you were not amongst the top 630 candidates.
Point B.1 of the competition notice stipulates that only those candidates with the 630 highest marks in the pre-selection tests would be asked to submit a full application with a view to their possible admission to the competition.
Your marks are as follows (1):
Test a): 38.333 /60 (pass mark 30)
Test b): 15.263 /20 (pass mark 10)
Test c): 30.769 /40 (pass mark 20)Total: 84.365/ 120
For your information, the candidates who obtained the 630 highest combined scores had at least 92.611 points.
I would add that the Selection Board’s decision does not preclude you from taking part in any future competitions organised by the European Personnel Selection Office.
It’s beyond me how one can get 15.263 / 20 when there were 40 questions, but anyway, c’est la vie. All the best to all the geeks who know who won the Sakharov prize in the year X or other equally useful everyday facts.
FILE DOWNLOADS
Blog commenter ‘viking’ has made some new test files available for download, and he had also supplied the manual for electronic Reserve Lists. Some additional test files have been provided by Sorina (see comment #1003) – download 342kb, ZIPped. Enjoy!
SOCIAL NETWORKS
If anyone is a member of Facebook there’s the ‘So I won’t be a Commission official’ Facebook Group, and the EU Integration Traveler IQ challenge (you need to add the Traveler IQ Facebook application) – a more fun way to revise for the concours…
NOTE
Due to such an enormous number of comments here I have had to divide the comments function. The latest few hundred comments are below, and all the older comments are archived here. All should work technically now.
@ etni
thanks etni, I know these tables, but my question is: if I have documented experience for 13 years and HR offer me a 9 grade, can I ask them to know how they calculate it or I just accept the offer?
@ PG
have a look at these tables
http://ec.europa.eu/civil_service/job/contract/grading_en.htm
@ etni
I didn’t specify that I was talking about a contract agent post – FGIII (the grade can be from 8 to 12 depending on your relevant experience)
@ PG
the grade is known when the vacancy is published, and before the candidates come to interviews – there is no way to change it afterwards. You may have a postgraduate diploma + 10 years experience and end up with AST3 grade, step 2. For a different post, you may end up in AD7 grade, step 2 – and that’s with exactly the same diploma and experience. It all depends on the post. Now, this is for contract & temp agent posts.
If you are a laureate of a competition, your grade is predetermined by it and cannot be changed.
@ Stefano
Could you please give me more informations about “grading” process? Could I know how HR unit calculate my grade if the offer doesn’t match my expected grade?
Thanks in advance
Kiwi and others who have been interviewed, would you mind telling us something general about what goes on during an interview? How many people did you talk to, how long did it last, what were the questions like? I too feel that starting work two months after the interview is a little soon, as there are so many arrangements to make. Let us know if they give you more time, Kiwi.
Thanks
What m and Chris want to say would be probably translated in bulgarian as “zatieba prostatka putka makina!!!”
@m: I agree.
Am I getting lost, or it is not any longer an “English-written” blog?
It would be nice if everyone could understand everyone!!
@AAA ; Nova
Radvam se da vidq 4e ima bulgari po forumite za tiq izpiti za EU. ima i edin sait epsoforum.com, kadeto ima razdel za BG, ama tam po4ti nqma jiva du6a. Ina4e az preminah ve4e edin izpit, i 4akam da me vikat na rabota, ama nqma dvijenie ve4e 4 meseca. podgotvqh se s vaprosi ot (veroqtno) sa6tiq sait, kadeto ima baza danni s vaprosi, kato si bqh kupil paket sre6tu 30-40 evro (ne pomnq ve4e to4no kolko). za ustniq izpit v Bruksel prosto sledqh izvestno vreme usardno saitovete svarzani s EU, za da sam v te4enie s ne6tata – kade kakvo stava.
Pozdravi
@Candidate X, @Stefano:
Salaries: there is no way to justify a bigger salary. When I was hired as CA from the CAST27 database, I tried to justify that my salary in the private market was more or less the same (somewhere in the Staff Regulations refers to “market conditions”). But I did not succeed. The only difference now is the daily subsistance allowance, and when the probation period will expire, then I’ll be earning the same.
I thought that at least my career will develop this way and will open new chances inside the Commission. What a mistake! I love where I live and work, but after the 3 years, I will have to go back home, and they’ll substitute me with somebody else, fresh from a new database. It’s not fair with me, but also is not fair for the DG where I work. They say: 3 years: 1 to learn, 1 to produce, 1 to look for another job.
But in this sense, these are the rules from DG ADMIN. Then you need to pass a concurs in order to be permanent. Those are the rules inside the Commission. In the agencies it’s different. And it’s funny, I only know one Agency, but they are proactive, proffessionals, helpful, and only 1 from more than 150 people was permanent, all the rest were temporary. Where I am right now… I cannot say the same.
Anyway, I recommend giving it a try. It will boost your career, but nowadays it’s better to think of it as a temporary appointment.
Best,
Oscar
PS: this is untrue for people from EU10. DG ADMIN is making real efforts to convert temporary contracts to permanent, so you guys have an excellent opportunity. But the people from EU15 (and sometimes Romania and Hungary) it’s not so easy, even if you are brilliant and a recognized international expert.
@Etni,
My i/v was less than 2 weeks ago so it’s still early days yet, but I might contact them in another couple of weeks. My profile has been changed to say that I’m in the process of being recruited, so that can only be a good sign 🙂
@ Kiwi
you could still double check with your unit at which point this would be required. If i’m not wrong, you went to the interview end of last year? it wouldn’t hurt to contact HoU secretary… i had my offer 3-4 weeks after the medical test and document submission (although this was a few years back).
Well they said at the end of the i/v that the HR dept would send me an offer, although I haven’t heard anything since then.
I was very surprised about the diploma thing, but I did ask the HR people before going up for the i/v and they said it wouldn’t be necessary to bring any diplomas or anything.
@ Kiwi
I find it quite strange that you didn’t need to show any info supporting your CV. Are you in touch with your future unit? Did they confirm after the interview that they are interested in employing you? I heard of cases when people were invited to the interview, left supporting docs with DG ADMIN and did the medical exam and only some time later learned they were not the candidate chosen. Also, some units hesitate for a long time before they give answers to the candidates. But maybe in EP it’s different, although I can’t imagine nobody would want to see your diploma! I would contact the unit just in case…
@Candidate X
No problem, the EU bodies (Commission, EP, Agencies, Joint Undertaking and soon) have different rules.
I have 8 years experience in private sector and 4 years (something more) in the EU Bodies, and I still have big doubts about the fact that the EU System is better than private sector.
I add a comment I got from most of my colleagues (former employees at City Bank and other Multi National Companies), they always say that the EU is more formal and less substantial and I fully agree on this. Would like to see more people working in a proactive way to increase people performances.
There is no discussion about salary, but most of the time we get good salaries, compared to the private market.
I suggest to ask to your people who will be your manager, how are they organized, what is the role you are going to cover into this organization.
Try to be positive and proactive, most of the skills are not relevant in the EU bodies, you can get training for almost everything, but this is important you clarify your position, this is a one way trip, most of the times it is difficult (with such salary) to go back, but can be very frustrating on the other side.
I hope this will help you in the future and I wish you good luck and all the best for your interview.
@ Etni
I wasn’t actually asked to provide any copies of diplomas or attestations from employers or anything, and didn’t meet anyone after my interview!
About the removal expenses: we will have to move all our stuff a couple of weeks before I start, so I presume this will mean no daily allowance.
Apparently the allowances etc should add up to a fair bit more than the basic salary, but exactly how much more will make a big difference to the type of housing we can afford, especially given the prices in Lux. Once I have the offer I think I will at least ask for some indication of what to expect – for example, it’s not entirely clear to me how much tax I will have to pay (I have heard 6% but am not sure if this is correct).
@A
Thanks for sharing your experiences…
Thank you Stefano, Fellow and others for your valuable advice. You may have saved me from making a blunder at the interview. In a private company, the salary negotiations are an important and sometimes decisive part of a job interview. I have read the Staff Regulation. However, if you feel that the salary they offer is a little too low considering your education and experience, at what point can you bring this up? For example if someone has 2 years’ relevant experience and someone else has 20, one would expect this to mean a different grade, not just a difference of a step or two.
@ A
as far as i know, you do not sign the contract if you are a functionnaire at teh Commission, only if you are contract/temporary agent
Etni, please do not say such things as “you won’t sign any contract…” The question was about working in an institution in the 21st century where most relationships (most of all employer-employee) are based on formal contracts. We are not talking about cleaning someone’s windows without anything on paper (as is mostly done in Belgian houses by women coming from poorer countries).
@ Kiwi
It will depend on communication between the medical service and DG ADMIN (at least, that’s how it would work in the Commission – i don’t know how it’s dealth with in EP). The person whom you met after your interview and submitted your diploma copies to is the one processing your personal file and the one who will send you the offer. You will have to accept it, and then agree on your starting date – but with your Head of Unit. The copy of the offer should be sent to your unit, so they will know and get in touch with you.
As a functionnaire, you won’t need to sign any contract. This means that you will accept the offer, agree on the date and just show up in Lux. You will be ‘appointed’ I believe… Stefano, correct me if I’m wrong 🙂 Together with your offer, you should receive a practical guide on starting to work for your institution which i advise you carefully read. Such doc should exist for EP if it exists for the Commission…
As for the salary, just take the basic salary as an indication. You have kids, are married, and will be an expat, that will all add up so I think it should be a bit more than your basic salary. Plus you should get two basic salaries extra (for yourself and your husband) if you both move to Lux. Plus daily allowance during the first 6 months, if you don’t submit your removal expenses (you can choose either to be reimbursed for removal, or get the daily allowance for 6 months, which is about 1K per month. If you can, in order to keep your allowance, do the removal later).
Does anyone have experience on written test on IT field at EFSA in Parma ?
@Kiwi
Signing the contract takes place usually on the first day you arrive at work. Then you do not begin working straight on. Instead you spend about half a day in the HR unit where you sign your contract among other things. This was my experience at least, even though, in my opinion, it would be more appropriate to sign the contract in advance and arrive at work already as someone formally entitled to work.
@ Etni
I did the medical exam at the same time as the interview and am now waiting for the job offer. The doctor said the medical exam was fine, pending the results of the blood/urine tests, although they said those would be through a few days later and that they would contact me if there was any problem. My unit did indicate that it would be ok with them for me to start at a later date… I will hold off giving notice etc though.
Any idea how long the process is likely to take? I assume the “end” of it is once a date has been agreed and some kind of contract signed?
@ Kiwi
I would wait with giving in notices etc. have you already gone through the medical exam? Which stage exactly are you in – between interview with your unit and medical exam, or between medical exam and the job offer? Keep in mind that institutions keep the rigth to withdraw the offer – usually until the very end of the process. One reason for withdrawal could be your unavailability to start at a certain date. Your future unit will have a say in this.
AD 126/8 – Internal audit concours
Does anyone know when the results of the written exams might come through?
I really want to know whether I am through.
Cheers
JF
@Kiwi
You are right, that depending on your grade, could mean from 200 to 500 Euro More/Less.
Obviously most of my colleagues will tell that we do not do this only for money, but 10 days can do a lot.
I have a case of a colleague who lost one step due to 1 month less of experience.
The amount was 500 Euro per month, on a yearly base 6.000 Euro.
The offer will give you only a PROVISIONAL GRADE, to be verified by PMO.
The starting date is negotiable, but pay attention to the fact that if there are other candidates, they could move to the next one.
Try to be diplomatic, most of them had he same problem and if you are reasonable, they will understand.
Again, pay a lot of attention to the rules. PMO is VER VERY STRICT.
Stefano
@ Stefano,
Thanks! Am I right in thinking that more than 3 years’ experience should equate to an extra step (but no more than one)?
For the offer, is it safe to assume it will eventually arrive and make arrangements accordingly (such as giving notice for job/house/childcare)? They actually wanted me to start 2 months after the i/v, although I want to start later – apparently I have to negotiate this once I receive the offer.
@Kiwi
Depending on the institution, from 1 month to few months.
@Kiwi
Entitlements are decided after you start your service. So, yes, if you are thinking that you will know your salary after few days after starting, you are right, and it is a surprise for everybody… If you get a step or 2, you will know after 5/6 days from your starting date.
Which is not expected.
@nova
Za purvi put kandidatstvam i moje bi ot okolo mesec pose6tavam tozi forum. Problem nai ve4e vijdam vuv vaprosite svurzani s EU. Az polzvam edin evropeiski sait , na koito ima baza danni s okolo 4000 vaprosa svurzani s EU. Ne sum siguren dali tqx imate predvid, kogato kazvate da se nazubrqt? Po otno6enie na vaprosite(num. ; verb.) ne mislq 4e tam 6te imam problem(az jiveq ot 9 godini v Amerika i sum OK s angliiskiq). Otnosno y4ebnicite, az imam samo edna kniga(“The Ultimate EU Test Book”).
Ako iskate da spodelite svoq opit s izpitite, a i s tova kak e da se raboti za evropeiska instituciq (polojitelni, otricatelni strani) bi mi bilo interesno. Mojete da pi6ete na sledniq email : ustrader007@gmail.com, za da ne natovarvame tozi blog s pisanici na bulgarski
Blagodarq
One more question for anyone who may know – how long after the interview does it normally take for a job offer to come through?
@ Stefano
At what point are the entitlements actually decided? When you accept the job offer/sign a contract/start work? I would like to know my actual salary before looking for accommodation (a couple of months before I start) so I know how much rent I can afford to pay!
@ Caro
I do know of one person who was on a Commission-only list and was never used (not sure how long for), and eventually they closed the list and one of the other institutions snapped the person up…
@ Giango
This is always a very tricky area of translation, systems that don’t have an equivalent in the other country. Personally I would avoid just putting the source text term in quotation marks, as the reader will probably have no idea what it means. What I would tend to do is try to find/invent an equivalent in the target language and then perhaps put the source text term in quotation marks in brackets to make it absolutely clear what you’re referring to. But I don’t know whether this is the advised procedure or not!!
@Candidate X
There is no secrecy around your salary in the EU institutions. Everything is decided on the base of EU Staff Regulation which is public and available for everyone on the net.
There you will find all the rules to determine your salary, basic salary (was revised last December 2008) and allowances, because they are not BENEFITS.
For your information, no one will give you the exact amount of salary until you will be a EU Civil Servant, because it is depending on the so called “Entitlements” which are decided by PMO (Pay Master Office).
So the salary process is not so trivial, you could say that you have the right to get the alowances, but the last word is left to PMO that have to take a decision based on very strict paramenters.
Anyway to have a clear understanding, please read the EU Staff Regulation and try to determine your salary. The rules are very clear and strict.
If you have any more question, do not hesitate to ask.
Very best regards
@ Candidate X ,
my advice is NOT to bring up the salary questions or other related matter in the interview.
The purpose of the interview is to assess whether you are a qualified candidate and in second step if you are the right person for the job.
Salaries and other issues are discussed when they give you the offer.
In fact, the people in the interview panel may not know exactly what your salary wil be. The grading is done by Human resources, the rights (allowances) by the paymaster etc …
@AAA
Ne se gotvia, v momenta sxm si dala pochivka. Ne uchastvam v nito edin ot novite konkursi, zashoto haresvam segashnata si rabota, a i sxm dlxjna da ne napuskam institutzijata 3 godini.
Interesuvah se za edna prijatelka v BG, kojato smiata da atakuva institutziite. Ot poluchenite mnenija razbrah, che horata se gotviat ot vse sxshtite uchebnitzi, ot koito se gotvihme predi 3 godini. A tolkova voda izteche ..
Za pxrvi pxt li kandidatstvate? Imam chuvstvoto, che otdavna vijdam imeto Vi vxv foruma.
Ne se plashete – vednxj nazubreni, vxprosite stavat lesni i skorostta na reshavaneto im pada do 10-12 sekundi/vxpros.
Uspeh!
Hi,
I’m soon having a job interview and would like to know whether the question of salary and other benefits will be brought up. If so, is it for you or the interviewer to mention them? Is there any room for negotiation? If you don’t mind, I’d rather not give any concours, institution, etc. details so as to avoid being identified by the institution that has invited me. Hope you’re willing to give tips despite this secrecy! Many thanks
Hi everyone! Since I plan to sit the next written test for lawyer-linguists (Italian language) , which consists of two translations from English and French legal texts into Italian. I would appreciate it very much if someone could give me some advice on how to prepare for it (e.g. what kind of texts should I expect, where can I find previous exam texts…). Thanks in advance!
@ A
Coming back to the dearth of English translators … the EU is now trying – a little too late – to motivate young English speakers to take a greater interest in learning languages (maybe they should have a word with the UK government instead and try to get them to teach languages as a compulsory subject in schools).
Re: reserve list for English translators – I saw that it was very short as well – is it possible that some candidates have asked for their details not to be put on the list? I can’t image it would make such a huge difference though!
I suppose one of the reasons that people get left on lists for so long that keep getting exptended really does have to do with language combination and experience – previous competitions have asked for ANY combination of two EU languages, and, whilst the EU needs the minority languages represented, most of the work is in fact with French, German etc. (see EU website for details of most common languages – I don’t want this to be taken as a bias on my part, but there is a core group of languages that accounts for the bulk of the work). So I expect that someone with two languages that generate less work would have to be trained up in one of the other “main” languages to keep them busy, whilst it is more effective to take on a translator with two languages for which there is greater demand and get them to add the more “exotic” languages.
Does anyone know if you can ultimately fail to make it off a list, especially if a new one has been drawn up in the meantime?
@nova
Kak varvi podgotovkata po vaprosite svurzani s EU?Golema muka sa tezi vaprosi.
Yspex
cosnic,
one explanation can be that there has been one or some candidates who failed the written test and after requesting a review, they have been allowed to pass to the oral.If this is the case, they have to organize new interviews and postpone the publication of the reserve lists.
After more than one year I guess you still need to wait an extra month!
@ Ala, Nova
Thanks for your answers … still foggy times even I already chose :-D.
Have a nice evening!
Btw, you’re involved in the similar competitions for bulgarians?
EPSO AD 99/07 – reserve list
Hi all,
does anybody of you know what is going on with the reserve lists for Administrators in the Building Sector?
I mean, in January the “Epso Planning” stated the oral tests were taking place in Dec 08 – Jan 09 and the reserve list was due in Jan or Feb 09.
Then, in early February another Epso planning still stating the oral tests took place in Dec-Jan and the reserve list will be out in Feb. So far so good, I guess (this is the first competition I am taking) it takes some time to publish the reserve lists after the oral tests are finished.
Today, another Epso Planning, stating the oral tests are still taking place and will continue until Mar 08, and the reserve list will be out in Mar 08 as well.
What sounds quite weird to me is that beginning of Feb it was stated the oral tests were in Dec and Jan (therefore I guess they were already finished when they published the planning), and now it is stated they will continue until March.
By the way, Epso has cancelled the two former plannings with the info indicated above…
Anyone has any idea on what might be happening? I am not that eager to know I didn’t pass the oral test 😀 but I don’t like either having this doubt.
Thanks to anyone who can shed light on that!
Nic
Pamela,
You may email me at newboy06@googlemail.com
Pamela,
Hope your not too exhausted & that congratulations are in order!
What’s your email add?
Have a few notes from the uk office that could help you on the next stage / repreparation ;-(
@Ala,
Eto ne k tebe otnositsia, a k Amaliei. Ja solidarna s tem, chto ti napisala ei. Schitaju, chto glupo zanimat ludei etim problemom i sprashivat o statistikah i tak dalee.
@nova
Я не поняла што ты cказала. Можеш cказать по руcки? Cпacибa.
Стига с тези тъпи номера, някой да ни свърши работата, а ние да оберем лаврите! Ако вместо да искаш съвети в последната секунда, си беше потърсила инфото сама, досега да си се ориентирала какво да кандидатстваш. Добре ти го е казала Ala, присъединявам се към нея.
Успех :)))))))))))
@Amalia
What you are asking for is longlasting and difficult job, and at the last minute!!
Statistics won’t help you even if acailable. Just ask yourself what you are better prepared for.
Business administration – there will be few good people going for this one and someone as smart as you will just conquer it.
on the other hand…
EPA – I heard that the panel will favour all named Amalia.
Well, the choice is yours!
:)))))))))))