The sheer number of comments at the main post ‘So I Won’t Be A Commission Official‘ has been causing problems, so all the old comments are here instead, and hence searchable.
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@Penko
I have passed the CAST27 competition in Function group 3 for Financial/Accounting officers. The job would be similar to your AST3, only that they are on a definite period of time.
Besides the classical UE knowledge& VN reasoning part, I had a multiple choice exam (computer based) with questions relating to the specialised part (accountancy and finance). I found it very easy. The accounting questions were basic ones (like basic credit and debit entries, amortisation, what’s a balance sheet etc). The finance part had some questions on the EU budget and some on what type of responsabilities have different types of staff regarding payments, approval of payments, monitoring etc.
If your written exam will consist also of an essay, I have no idea how it could be like.
@AD
The competition number is EPSO/AST/43/07 – Assistants (AST3) of Bulgarian citizenship, and my field is Financial management/accountancy.
I read the notice, and am aware what the tests are, my question was if someone has passed similar tests and if they can let me know of the kinds of questions and the dificulty?
Thanks!
@ Penko
You’ve essentially been admitted to the competition and asked to submit a full application, I think. The competition notice should have a clear explanation of what the next tests will be. The procedure is outlined in the notice. What is the competition nr?
Hello,
I have a question for all of you who have passed a competition all the way.
I just got an email today that I have passed the computer based test for AST3 for BG and RO citizens (I’m in the financial profile). There are supposedly 40 positions for Bulgarians and 150 people have passed the first stage. I am now invited to mail in my full CV, with copies of my diplomas, etc.
So, my question is, does anyone have an idea what the second test consists of? Are the questions much harder?
Thank you in advance for any information.
I have been reading this blog for 2 years and find it very interesting and helpful most of the time.
But I get the impression that if people here are complaining against EPSO and recruitment, they are welcomed. When somebody, who has succeeded, writes about his experience, he receives only unpleasant remarks.
Tomaz had the simple desire to encourage people or help with information how somebody had managed to get the job. There is no need for such qualifications as “cynical” etc.
Otherwise, the people who succeded will leave quitely and never tell how they did it. Only the frustrated ones will post here.
To suggest that successful candidates from the EU-15 should do a stage or something like that first in order to get a job, is totally unacceptable.
And the patronizing tone in Tomaz posts could be interpreted as outright cynical.
We shouldn’t really compare apples with pears for the time being.
It’s not (exclusively) a matter of pride. If you are managing projects; writing strategic papers, doing workshops/presentations and putting out papers on analytic methods (that’s not me, I’m just shitting dipers over at Walmart’s) and you feel that’s why you were selected as a laureate among other reasons, then what sense would it make to become a stagiaire?
This can only harm your career/CV at this point of your life and reflect badly on you (in a logical universe that is). As those quota mainly target AD laureates and those 2005 comps were the first in some time for EU15 people… you can count on most of those people being in their late 20ies/early 30ies and boasting a succesful career. Given the above elements I found the post somewhat provocative (but as I said, I like a good stir and people should stop apologizing so quickly on here; you are all too (annoyingly) kind 😉 )
@Tomaz
Thanks for sharing with us your experiences. However, it is a well known fact that the DGs prefer laureates with relevant experience in their fields of operation, so I am not quite surprised that you got offers so quickly. The problem lies with the majority of laureates, who do not necessarily possess relevant experience to the DGs operations..as far as I know, those are considered (by them) as 2nd or even 3rd choice laureates (unofficially, ofcourse…)..
@frustrated
I think Tomaz was just saying that “putting your foot on the door†as a strategy sometimes pays off. And again, I agree that it is also a personal matter if you could swallow your pride and serve coffee, or if you could simply financially afford doing so. Just get me right, I am not trying to be anyone’s advocate here, but in big US law firms for example, every new-coming lawyer (fresh from the Law School) starts as paralegal. And guess what……. making coffee and photo copies are part of the job.
Best to all!
Tomaz…
I don’t mind a good stir now and then, but the example you quote (dropping job to become a stagiaire) to me is ridiculous. You don’t get to be a stagiaire just like that; it probably takes even more lobbying and if you do become a stagiaire it would seem odd to me that you would get to do the most challenging work at the commission; why would that be good for your CV? The underlaying guilt trip thing (“you would have made if you really really wanted it) reminds me of people shitting their dipers over at Walmart’s graveyard shift, being told they are living the American dream.
I went to some epso/commission showcase thing and you had these 50 yo babyboomers telling all the kids in the room doing work at some Brussels-based NGO would be a great way to start a possible commission career… I just believe it’s a modern form of slavery and bear in mind it’s also pretty shitty for people who actually work because they need the money… if your daddy pays for your little NGO/stagiaire adventures it’s all very nice.
Just my thoughts….
@frustrated and to whomever might feel the same
I apologise if my post upset you. This was not my intention. And neither was intended to be a provocation. As I said I hoped it would bring some positivism to the forum. If you do not see it that way, I am sorry.
I agree it is a questionable choice to drop a good job, stock options, cars and career and go for pocket money. But that is exactly what my friend did, because she really wanted to work for the EU institution and was prepared to do almost anything to achieve her goals. And she did it!
I’m one of those people that believe anything is possible. And trust me, if you build your career in the private sector, you could get an option to get in the EU institutions at a higher level and thus surpassing in wage all of us that might get in “without competing” as you put it. So good luck and I hope you succeed.
Again let me just finish, that my post was not intended to be provocative and/or insulting and I appologise if anyone feels this way. I do not intend to get back on this topic, not to clog the forum with unnecessary discussions.
Best,
Tomaz
Just a small word of clarification on how the systems work here…
(1) If you post comments using the same name and e-mail address each time then your comments appear immediately without moderation. I still get an e-mail informing me when a comment has been posted, so I can choose to remove it subsequently if I wish to (although 99.9% of the time I do not).
(2) If you use a combination of a name and e-mail address that has not been used here before then a first comment has to be approved by me, and thereafter that person can post.
Please also bear in mind that I also have some other data from the people posting that allows me to monitor things – the IP addresses, and domain names from which people are posting things for example – so I have ways to check the validity of what’s being posted. I also see what e-mail addresses people are using, although understandably these don’t appear on the website…
Hope that makes things clear folks!
but I still think it’s real funny, one of my all-time favourite posts; you make it sound like joining Up With People or some scouting jamboree… live like a student at night and make you some coffee and staple copies during the day.
and that “previous post” dissapeared instantanteously!
Jon is making this place fool-proof.
Let me get backt to Tomaz:
1) We are NOT competing, that’s precizely the problem.
2) Is this some sort of provocation
2a) stagiaires should be at most 30 yo. The comp I did was the first since I left university … in all you could wait 8 years 😉
2b) you nee dto get into (and out of) come bluebook; same jobbery all over again
2c) Would you have people on 5K, with a car, stock options… drop everything for some vague possbilty and pocket money?
Great piss-take though… you’ll get the puppets going with this one.
sorry, previous post was by me… I meant to write “@ Tomaz”, but it ended up as my name.
Hi Everybody
I have been reading this post for the past year or so. It has provided me with a lot of interesting information that would otherwise remain hidden to me. Well now I would just like to share mine and my friend’s experience regarding the whole recruitment process and maybe with this give some encouragement to all that may start becoming “frustrated”, “disillusioned”, “disappointed” or even “angry”…
Let me start with my example. I am from one of the new member states. I did the concour for the new member states and got results in December. Without sending any CV or letters of interest (well call me optimistic) i received several (5) interview proposals from the DG employment and one from DG Relex. In the end I got offers from both, which even allowed me to choose. So even if one does not send any CVs or letters of interest, there still is a chance. My suggestion – write as many of your interests and experiences in your CV, because they fish-out CVs on key-words. For example for me they saw structural funds experience (DG Employment) and Latin America trade negotiations experience (DG Relex). After they fish you out it is up to you to successfully sell yourselves.
And now the experience of my friend. She is from the old member states – Italy. It is true that to get in from the old member states one needs to work a lot harder. But one thing that runs in your advantage is that the recruiting people (at least some of them) are frustrated that they cannot choose from the pool of 27 member states. But for you just being on the reserve list will not do, because as we all know until don’t-know-when your CVs will be automatically left out, when looking for potential candidates. What my friend did, was a very brave thing, and proves that if one really WANTS to work for the EU and IS a very strong candidate it does not matter which member state you are from. She quit her well payed and interesting job and she went to Brussels to work as a stagier for less than 1.000 EUR a month!!! Went back to live like a student again! However during her time as a stagier she proved herself as a hard working and a very smart individual and her DG went through whole lot of processes in order to be able to keep her. She passed EU-27 like many of you and now she’s inside!
So my point is. Do not loose hope. Whether you are from the old or the new member states. But before you start blaming the EU and the EPSO of being non-transparent, non-efficient and unfair, think (for the old member states) whether you are ready to sacrifice a lot just to be inside, and (for the new member states) keep in mind that while you are not directly competing with the old member states you ARE competing with a huge number of very strong candidates from the new member states. I am not saying you are not strong candidates, but just that the competition is fierce. So keep your CVs wide, write letters if possible, get into informal contacts and once you’re in the interview, SELL YOURSELF… there you have only yourself to blame for success or failure!
Good luck to everyone. And I hope my post raises some optimism amongst all of you!!!
Best wishes
Tomaz
lia2, I don’t know the guy (and I’m glad that I don’t), just I don’t think that a Bulgarian would say “Head õhtut!” at the end of a posting (see comment 1457 of Dimitriov).
Anyway, let’s not waste any more time on this. The guy doesn’t deserve it.
Hi to all of you guys and congragulations for keeping this forum going for sometime now..I am also a humble, EU12 laureate and I have already attended a medical check and an interview (unsuccesful) in Brussels. I do, generally, agree that the recruitment procedure followed by the EU does not, at least, look “fair”, given the existence of these nationality “quotas”, the covert “favouritism” or nepotism etc. It is my opinion that if we want to build a fairer,non-discriminatory Europe we must all encourage and accept recruitment on purely merit basis…since increased competition will,eventually, make us all better..
Jon enjoys the”olympic” point-of-view here. His omniscience will allow him to appreciate elements of dramatic irony.
I agree with Jon and Lia2; this place is to valuable to let it go to waste.
Steven should know that his country’s perm rep is about the least active of them all: no preparatory programs, no information sessions, no access to databases, no little network booklets, no nothing… mails will not be answered btw. Another reason why Steven should wish to have been born Dutch.
Re: “Dimitriov”
I agree with Sebastian and Viking. While reading the posts today I couldn’t escape the feeling that was someone’s character playing “devil’s advocate.” But I guess Sebastian’s term “troll” sums it up even better. Three things have made me suspicious:
1. the obvious contradiction in his discourse: asking Steven not attempt to divide us, to make us argue on ridiculous issues yet he was the one trying to keep fueling the argument. (something Sebastian rightly and duly noted and in a stile that very much reminds, as Viking noted, Borat)
2. the dramatic exit: “Farewell” – hardly any foreigner would use such a phrase
3. Lia was so sure Dimitriov was not Bulgarian…
Indeed, a smart choice in leaving this forum. In any case, if that was a “test”, the people on this forum passed it very well I’d say. Happy Dimitriov?
Look folks, please keep it calm. And please make sure you post using the same name all the time.
While e-mail addresses might not appear here, I do see the e-mail addresses associated with each post, so I can see what’s going on.
The fact that this is comment #1483 on this post shows this forum is useful. It’s free to use, ad free, and not restricted – please keep it that way.
the nickname dimitriov sounds bulgarian, mentioning 80 million potential citizens sounds kaczynski-polish, the devastated english sounds like borat.
I agree with Sebastian that this is a hoax.
anyway, dimitriov: your choice to leave this forum is indeed an intelligent one. thank you for that and good luck in the future.
Dear Sebastian,
Thanks for the information. I am actively pursuing but I haven’t got anywhere contacting the Permanent Representation of my country (which is Belgium, maybe that is why). Maybe I should give it another try. I would indeed save me a lot of time and effort if only I knew where my applications stand a chance.
Most sincerely,
Steven
No, Dimitriov is not Bulgarian. Luckily….
@ Natacha
Per capita = per head. It’s a latin term that’s become a term of art in economics and politics. Now it simply means “per person”, so if you have, let’s say, a country with 10,000 Euro GDP per capita, it simply means that you have an economy that creates an AVERAGE of 10,000 Euro per member of the population.
Dimitriov, are you bulgarian? Because if you are, I am ashamed of you as bulgarian!
Really, can’t you understand why so many people here pick Steven’s side???
What does “capita” mean? is it French?
I see most people on this forum pick Steven’s side. I am sad my people are not made to feel welcome. Nevertheless, I shall be the intelligent one in this “debate” and withdraw from this forum.
Farewell
Just to make sure the point come across:
Number of AD5 officials / capita; indexed to the UK.
COUNTRY INDEX
MT 48.480
EE 20.200
CY 16.160
SL 15.352
LV 12.120
LT 11.334
SK 8.080
HU 7.434
CZ 6.197
BG 4.731
PL 3.059
RO 1.876
BE 1.748
IE 918
FI 898
LU 824
FR 452
ES 449
DK 374
DE 373
AT 345
SE 314
GR 302
IT 263
PT 242
NL 187
GB 100
http://ec.europa.eu/civil_service/docs/bs_sexe_nat_grade_en.pdf
Look at these figures… there are now almost 4 times as many Polish AD5 officials than German ones… a 1/8 distortion… 110 Slovakian AD5 officials compared to 39 Italians… which is what a 1/60 distortion…? And this should even get worse until 2010?
What’s the endpoint the commission is aiming at: a 1/100 distortion per generational/hierarchic layer?
The few EU15 AD5 people that do get in will easily become Heads-of-unit… but who are those people… insiders right?
My generation of EU15 outsider aureates says thank you very much!
Dimitriov seems to be your classic troll!
The reference to WWII is really classy, mate.
And pretty ridiculous too.
And Steven posed a legitimate question, he didn’t even make any reference to EU-12.
To answer Steven’s question (and you shouldn’t really apologize to the troll, probably someone from an old MS, who didn’t pass a concours anyway):
I know of EU-15 people having been recruited from the AD/25/05. Most of them though, seem to be former contract agents, temporary agents etc.
I know of people who couldn’t be hired by units interested in them, because the specific DG hadn’t fulfilled the quota at that time.
Are you actively pursuing your recruitment?
You should check with the Permanent Representation of your Member State. Usually they get the info from DG Admin, which DGs are closed/open for EU-15 as this changes every three months or so.
One more thing for “Dimitriov”, even though he shouldn’t be dignified with a response:
As I read in a different forum, the recent wave of enlargement competitions couldn’t even produce the planned number of successful candidates. It was rightly pointed out that there are only two possible reasons for that: either a lack of interest in these countries (i.e. EU 10) or a lack of sufficient numbers of qualified candidates. If you listen to the gossip in BXL and use it as an empirical basis, the latter seems to be rather the case.
@ Breach,
Appreciate your comments, but I feel there is an inherent impossibility to raise various national stakes among eu AD officials in 7 years’ time, when new AD5/6 officials will put in 30 years on average. This is highly disruptive as it implies proportionally at least 4 times a many people will come from certain countries in a limited time frame, which 1)is bound to infringe on quality standards and 2) will completely upset the generational/hierarchical composition for commission staff from a nationality perspective… the commission is now a tiramisu with an AD5 layer almost entirely made up of EU12 officials. How will this evolve in following decades for Christ’s sake? The agony on this forum is only the beginning… they made a fine mess, congratz.
And given that at least one quota resolution (2006) was voted well after the 2005 AD EU15 inscriptions, I feel we can easily conclude the commission has wasted a lot of valuable career time for a lot of EU15 people.
@ Dimitriov
Give it a break, D. Steven keeps asking the same question because you brush him off every time (in a quite impolite way, I’d say).
Nobody wishes any old MS – new MS nonsense here Steven has explained his intentions and they do not seem bad in any way. Why should he refrain from asking any questions on this forum?
@Dimitriov, maaan chill out :-] I have practically seen zero xeno/nationality bigotry on this blog so far, and yours are the exact kind of comments which lead to that.
IMHO, any kind of quota based on whatever is IMHO disruptive and discriminative, kind of reminds me of the U.S. ‘affirmative action’. Yet, when you deal with EU enlargement you got to do something to allow people from the newer Member States to actually become part of the institutional engine. Though I’m EU-2, I fully understand the frustration of EU15 candidates who made the concourse, and are now in for a bitter surprise. When you wanna establish a baseline representation of countries new to the EU, you’d plan EU15 position numbers in a bit more realistic way, so that you don’t have a large percentage of laureates with no real prospects of getting a job (I’m getting the impression that isn’t the case). Also, you’d set a formal transition period, after which everyone would be put on equal footing again. I wonder whether any of this has been given thought and is in place?
@Dimitrov
We have a saying in my country:
“If me grandma had wheels she would be a bycicle”
You have serious troubles man…give it a rest.
Regards
Elena, concours for public functions serve two purposes:
1) (to instill the perception of) transparency and equity as we are dealing with publicly funded jobs here
2) to keep the biggest idiots out
The same two criteria apply to the intra-list merit groups at micro-level.
After that, it’s down to CV, interviews and various imponderabilia.
The first purpose thus is not to get the best and the finest; one would just hope most of those are among the lucky. It is not designed to be positively specific but rather negatively sensitive (if that jargon makes any sense).
I would say the main problem with the durrent shananigans is rather one of transparency/equity than quality of laureates. Only inviting 10% (or 40%) based on nationality is first and foremost wrong on that account.
@frogatsu
You wrote:
“I increasingly hear rumours that Commission services are openly objecting the quota system, due to the lack of sufficiently qualified EU12 candidates and to the tempting availability of many fresh EU15 laureats. This does not mean, obviously, that there are no qualified EU12 officials: there were, and many, but the best ones were taken as soon as the lists of their concours were out and what is left now is not really first choice.”
Even if someone has an impressive CV this does not mean that person is necessarily better than another one. To identify the best candidates means (in my opinion) to make a comparison between candidates, but if they invite only let’s say 10% how can they be sure that they choose the best ?
@Dimitriov
As you probably know, ECSC (1951) was seen as foundational in bringing together Europe in peace after the WWII
My grandfather dead in that war, but now, as I said, we are Europeans.
We are working Together to improve our Europe.
Sincerely, I hope that you did not passed an open-competition, too much hatred in your words.
@ froggy,
it’s not EU15 laureates across the board who are the but of this idiotic joke, it’s EU15 outsider laureates… most insiders on the reserve lists got “regularized” by now.
Minor nuance…
@Steven
EU Institutions ‘should employ’ people based on their knowledge.
No difference based on country, sex, religion, bla, bla, bla..funny thing, anyway…
First of all, we are Europeans!
Steven, if you are one of the best in your work, for sure you will be employed soon!
Which apologies?
Too good guy.
All the best for your future!
If Western Europe (Germany) had not killed half of my people during WWII, today we would have numbered well over 80 million and the quota would have to be doubled.
We earned this compensation more than enough.
See, now the incident makes us discuss wars… this is terrible!
Thanks frogatsu for your encouraging words.
I am not giving up you know, but I just needed some fresh energy. I think you just gave me some.
Steven
@ Steven (and Dimitrov)
Dear Steven,
All my support for your research: I think you have apologised even too much to Dimitrov. People of the EU15 do find enormous difficulties in finding a job because of more than 3400 permanent positions reserved to EU12 from 2004 to 2010. Stating this is not an insult, is just reality. I would go even further: because the recruitment of the above EU12 officials would have excessively increased the salary expenses, the new staff regulation of May 2004 decreased significantly the starting salary of all officials, creating – among EU15 officials only – a painful discrimination between those recruited before 1 May 2004 and those recruited afterwards.
Do not give up: I was in your situation until a few weeks ago and then, all of a sudden, I had an offer, which I have accepted. I increasingly hear rumours that Commission services are openly objecting the quota system, due to the lack of sufficiently qualified EU12 candidates and to the tempting availability of many fresh EU15 laureats. This does not mean, obviously, that there are no qualified EU12 officials: there were, and many, but the best ones were taken as soon as the lists of their concours were out and what is left now is not really first choice. All DGs were told by DG Admin to take 3rd choice EU12 laureats from lists published 2-3 yers ago and not to take 1st choice EU15 laureats from last year’s concours: as you can imagine, this could not last long.
Good luck!
Dimitrov,
I can not believe it….you should take a rest, not Steven!
@ Steven
I am also from the old MS (probably same one as you, .be ? ) and I recently passed the CAST 27 competition. I have not yet been invited for an interview but I’m willing to exchange information if it happens.
Email : arne at skynet dot be
Great incident btw, I had a good laugh
Arne
Dear Dimitriov,
I am terribly sorry if I offended you.
That was not the aim of my post.
Please accept my sincerest apologies….
Steven
Dear Steven,
Where I come from asking the same question 4 times is considered bad manners. You have had your say and you have managed to create an incident. I’d suggest you give it a rest now. I do wonder whether you aren’t an agent provocateur of some fiendish device.
Head õhtut!
Dimitriov,
Damn you are an itchy fella 😉
I DO AGREE that it is not OK to treat people from EU 10+2 as second rate. Reread what I have written so far and you will see I did nothing of the sort.
I do know some very undeserving Bulgarians, Polish, Cypriots but then again I know stupid French, Belgian, German and Italian as well.
As I said, I was not adressing people like yourself (so shut up and do not tell me to do so ;-)) nor expressing an opinion nor implying anything. I am just trying to get into contact with people who are in the same situation as I am – not to overload this blog with racial slurs but to exchange information via e-mail.
FYI: I have used another forum in the past and it turned out great: I now know 5 people from the same reserve list and we keep each other informed in a very friendly and open manner.
So no I will not let it rest – why should I ? – and repeat my question: anyone from the OLD MS wanting to exchange info?
Thank you.
Steven
@Kostas:
“I find it absolutely fare that one who has worked for a long time as a contract agent or a temporary agent, doing the job of a permanent, should have the right to become permanent. Why not?”
Just an opinion here — in general I agree, why not? However, there are least two issues, which need to be addressed for this:
The very real dangers of entrance criteria double standards and these of sycophantism and nepotism. (note, I say ‘dangers’ as in possibility). Worse cases aside, heck, everyone would prefer to recruit people they’d worked and are happy working with. (note, I say . Passing an open competition may not be impossible feat (hell, even I did it), but nonetheless it’s a pretty damn hard and time consuming. So if you ask me whether someone should be allowed to pass an interview for a temp job, work three years and become an official, just like that, well… For fairness sake, I think at least two things need to be there for the system to be fair and square to everyone involved: a) Their performance assessment for that time should meet some set, positive criteria, and b) they need to pass an accreditation exam at least close to the level of an open competition in their area.
And last, but not least, this possibility should be clearly defined, transparent and due standard applied. Just my two (euro) cents. Cheers.
Steven,
You may mean well, but you do wrong.
Please refrain from that topic; it sets bad blood. Look at what’s happening yet again. It is not OK to treat EU12 citizens as second-rate.
Now let the topic rest; thank you.